Truth Talk: The Experiment of Non-Ownership – Week 9 Update
Truth Talk: The Experiment of Non-Ownership – Week 9 Update
Transcript
The following is a transcription of The Experiment of Non-Ownership – Week 9 Update, which is part of Robin’s “Truth Talks” series during his experiment in non-ownership.
For the full series and depth to this practice, visit: The Experiment in Non-Ownership – Robin Greenfield in Los Angeles.
Hello everyone, It’s good to be with you. And ‘Hello’ to the fellows and the ladies and all the human beings that are out there watching through the internet. We’re here in Griffith Park and I’m going to speak to all of you just as if you are here with us.
So, it’s nine weeks into the experiment in non-ownership, and tonight I wanted to give an update on the experiment, being a little over two months in and share about the purpose of this experiment of non-ownership, why I’m doing it, what I have learned from it a little bit, or what the experience has been like and break down a little bit the details of how this works. How I’m existing while owning … I want to say absolutely nothing, but I’ve really come to surrender to the fact that I own these couple pieces of paper and there’s no way around it. I own these papers. The experiment is a total failure. [laughs] No. It’s all a part of the experiment. So, yeah, that’s my intention. Just to share an update and for those of you who are interested, intrigued, and wanting to learn, and for those of you on the internet … who are watching through the internet, I would love that you would be able to ask questions, but if you did, they wouldn’t get to me for quite some time. But, hopefully, maybe you have some questions and they would be the same ones that people out there would have.
So, first I want to give a little summary. I have some notes here just so I can …. There’s a lot. There’s a lot wrapped up into this whole experiment, and I want to make sure that I talk about all of the aspects of it.
So first. Nine weeks in. The first week-and-a-half, I was here in Griffith Park. I arrived on January 26th, having walked from Canada to Los Angeles. And when I arrived here, I gave away everything I owned … every physical possession. Basically sitting right about there, but basically here, and gave away all the money that I had as well, which was down to a couple hundred dollars, if I recall? $221, maybe it was. And I sat there in a palm leaf for a moment in time before borrowing a few possessions and this experiment began.
After ten days here in Griffith Park, I went to a Vipassana Meditation Center, where I did a ten-day silent meditation, vipassana. The purpose of vipassana is … well, one of the ways of vipassana is to say to see things as they truly are. It is the direct teachings of the Buddha on how to become enlightened. Not that you become enlightened in ten days, but it’s the practice that helps you to break free from our own minds and liberate ourselves and walk the path toward enlightenment, of less suffering and more joy and connection. And it’s a very deep practice, very meaningful to me.
So for me to be able to go to this Vipassana Center … it was so perfect. Because you’re practicing kind of dissolving the self. Goenka, the teacher, talks about the concept of ‘I,’ ‘me,’ ‘mine.’ Well, I had already given away my mind. There was no mind. And now I got to practice dissolving the ‘I’ and the ‘me.’ So it was an ideal scenario for that. And so, I did a ten-day sit … a ten-day meditation. And then after that, I did a ten-day serve, where I served the new students who were there to do a meditation for their ten days. And I won’t talk … I won’t dive into that much now, because I could easily talk about that whole experience for multiple hours, but if you have questions that pop up at the end, we can talk about that.
So originally … “Hello, Friend! We’re happy for you to join us! … Hey, just starting to talk about the experiment of non-ownership. … Yeah, got a spot for ya’. Yeah.” So, I was originally planning on being at the vipassana for three of the ten-day sessions: one sit, and then two serves, but I ended up staying for just two total instead. And that’s kind of a longer story as to how my plans changed a little bit. But, what I’ll say is what I ended up doing was … I had about two weeks to spare, and instead of being there, I decided to walk from Los Angeles to the Mexico border. It turned out that the amount of time it takes to walk from Los Angeles to the Mexican border is about the same as to do a ten-day vipassana. So it really worked out well.
One of the students from vipassana dropped me off in Santa Monica. I had a sleeping bag, a sweater and pants that I had borrowed from them. Just those three items. And I left from there, and this was a whole new challenge. When I planned this three-month experiment of non-ownership, the idea was that I would be in place, which makes it much easier to meet my basic needs. But this was walking 175 or so miles with no shoes, no computer or phone, no map. You know, I just started heading south. So it was a real, real challenge. And I slept outside on the ground, just with my sleeping bag on the ground, which was a new challenge, to be able to, you know, see how I could do that. And the first week, I ate almost exclusively from the garbage. I was walking through Orange County a lot, so it was a lot of wealthy areas, so I ate pretty well from the garbages from there. And so it was a pretty interesting experiment for me to see that all I needed were my legs, my mind, a simple place to sleep under some trees, and some garbage cans with food in them. And that’s what I did, you know, for those days. But it was quite challenging. And it tested my … some of my abilities. I ended up … one of the aspects of this experiment in non-ownership is that I’m also taking a break from being online. But that was very hard to do because I couldn’t find any detailed maps. So I was asking people for directions, and it ended up with me looking at screens here and there. I broke some of my aspirations a little bit. But again, that’s why this is an experiment. It’s not about perfection. And I go with it.
So back to … oh, so after that walk, I returned to …. Well, one other thing I’ll share about that is that along the way, I ended up scheduling gatherings at many of the cities that I passed through. And that was also another challenge, ‘cause not only was I walking with no money, no shoes, no possessions, no phone, no computer, no longer able to get whatever I get whenever I get there; now I had a timeline where I had to be in different places. So that was a whole ‘nother aspect of the challenge. And it turned out to be a quite rainy stretch of the time. Four of the twelvish days were rainy, so I was wearing a garbage bag for a good little portion of it. So … but it was a beautiful test and quite a joyous experience.
So, kind of go back now to why do this experiment on non-ownership? Certainly some people would look at this and say, like, “Why put yourself through this?” You know, this looks like you would be suffering. It looks like it would be challenging to not have basic needs met, to not have possessions, and why do this when you had possessions before? Why give them away and then need to borrow other people’s possessions? You had a blanket and now you’re borrowing someone else’s blanket. A lot of people just don’t understand it.
So I want to share a few of my reasons for it. First of all, for me this experiment of non-ownership … it’s not something that was a spur of the moment decision. It’s something that I have really been aspiring to do for at least eight years. This was an idea I had at least eight years ago: to get to the point where I own absolutely nothing. And so … and then the other aspect is that me owning nothing right now is very in alignment with my whole life design. I’ve owned as few as 44 possessions, or just 111 possessions at different times. I’ve simplified my life down to needing very little. And so, getting down to absolutely nothing was actually only one step among the many steps in simplifying my life and living more sustainably and working to, you know, liberate my mind and live more in the present and all these things.
So, one of the things that I do is take on extreme projects, extreme endeavors that are designed to develop my mind, develop my relationship with the Earth, my relationship with humanity and with the plants and animals we share this home with. And I deeply believe that owning nothing for a period of time, or my entire lifetime, there’s so much value that can be gained from that … so much benefit. So, at the heart of that … one of the aspects is that a lot of us, when we think about ownership, we think ownership is. It’s not a concept, it’s a reality. It’s a solidity. But when you actually look closely, you can see that ownership is more of an illusion than a solid concept. You can buy a piece of land, but the land has not entered into that agreement. That’s just something two humans did. The animals that live on that land … they didn’t agree to that contract. Often the other humans who used to live there didn’t agree to that contract. It’s just a couple of people or … and sometimes it’s whole nations living under delusions. And so, to practice non-ownership is to dissolve a pretty … one of the most unquestioned illusions that we have as humanity today. Many cultures around the world have never had the concept of ownership. And there’s still some cultures that exist today where ownership is non-existent, or at least a fraction, of what it is for us. So, for me, this is testing the … it’s really stepping deeply outside a lot of the framework that’s unquestionable. And the big part of that is I do want people to question everything. Because everything … well, when you actually start to pull back the layers of our government, our corporations and our existence, if we want to live in a state of truth, we realize that we actually do need to question everything to get to that state of truth and integrity.
And the same goes for money. So, as part of this experiment, I have no money. And I will not have money for this whole three months. Same thing: money is an illusion. A huge documentary for me early in my awakening was “Zeitgeist,” learning that money is just a concept and it only stands if enough people believe in it. But if nobody believed in it, it would hold no value. The paper holds no value. And these days it’s just numbers on a screen, for the most part.
So at the heart of all of this, my belief is that the concepts of ownership and the concepts of money create an incredible separation among us: a separation from the Earth, a separation from the plants and animals we share this Earth with, a separation from the people close to us, a separation from the people on the other side of the world, and a separation within ourselves. So by owning nothing and having no money, a big part of that is stepping outside of that separation and embracing interconnectedness. By being here, I am saying that I am dependent upon other people. I’m wearing other people’s clothes, I’m kept warm with their blankets, I’m borrowing their books, I have their bowl, a pencil, a towel. I don’t own any of this. I am dependent on others. So, this is my way of dissolving that illusion of separateness that is so deeply ingrained into myself.
So my belief is that it is this delusion of separateness that allows us to exploit, that allows us to pillage, that allows us to destroy, that allows us to accumulate such incredible wealth, while others have so little; that creates this incredible wealth gap. My belief is that if we didn’t have these systems of separateness, that we wouldn’t destroy and exploit and oppress like we are. So this is my way of going to the extreme and experimenting with interconnectedness vs separateness.
And then at the heart of this is the concept of living simply so that others may simply live. Mahatma Gandhi is one of my greatest inspirations and that’s a quote of his: “Live simply so that others may simply live.” Now, to some, I’m sure they hear that and they just don’t get to the bottom of it. Okay, live simply so that others may simply live. But, this is at the core of my entire life design.
So the reason why in 2011, when I was living a pretty typical US American lifestyle, I started to … well, what happened was, I started to watch some documentaries and read some books, and what I learned is that everything that I was doing was a part of such systems of complexity and outsourcing that were designed in a way that created an incredible burden upon the Earth, upon the plants and animals we share this home with and upon our fellow humans. The food that I was eating, the car I was driving, the gas I was pumping into the car, the cheap stuff I was buying, the trash I was creating, the money I had invested, the money in my bank account, the credit card I swiped. Every single thing that I was doing was causing destruction … it was all behind closed doors and the burden was all hidden. But I learned that almost every single thing we do today in this modern society that has consumer convenience … the truth is that somebody’s paying for that convenience. Just like the concept that energy is not created nor destroyed, I believe that’s the case with convenience. When there’s convenience, we have to look at where … how’s this convenience existing? And almost always, it ties back to suffering and exploitation.
Now, particularly speaking about consumer convenience. We can create convenience that doesn’t have suffering and burdens. Like, we could cook a big pot of soup and eat that every day for the next week and that doesn’t mean that someone is suffering. But when the convenience comes through consumer, modern development-type stuff, then almost every time I look, I see there’s someone paying for this. That’s the truth. So, this is an extreme test in living simply.
So, a couple notes on that. The United States has five percent of the world’s population, but consumes 25% of the world’s resources. That, by definition, is extreme. So my way of life compared to that is extreme, but when you’re looking at this, I’m actually living much closer to the global norm. I’ve just been compared to this extreme consumer society.
And the other big statistic for me is that one percent of the world’s population holds 50% of the world’s wealth. So this is another way of me just immersing myself and saying I am not willing to be a part of that one percent and I think I’d rather see instead of one person with a table one mile long full of food and then they waste 90% of it, why not make sure everybody’s got enough food? And this is my way of being able to do something that’s sort of unique and extreme and allows me to be able to talk about this in the mainstream as well.
And so, yeah. The ultimate test of getting my life to the basic needs. So during this time, there’s no, like, “I want this shirt,” “I want this exact food.” Although it is there. Like, I wanted ginger, and I got ginger last night, ‘cause I’m feeling a little, like, below the weather. Is that the word? … Under the weather. Or the phrase. So there is still some clinging and attachments for sure, and there’s still some preference, but right now I’m practicing getting my life down to the bare necessities, [sings] “the simple bare necessities” … I’ve been singing that song lately. I love it. But so, getting life down to the basic needs. Because the reality is that we all need a lot less than we think we do. Or at least those of us who are watching this and those of us who are sitting here. We all need a lot less than we think we do and when we need less, we can instead spend our time being of service. That’s a big part of this.
So, lastly, before getting into the next section is, some of the practices I’m doing right now, by having nothing, I have more time than I used to in certain ways. I’m not on the computer. I’ve removed a lot of the distractions, so connection to Earth is a big part of what I’m doing right now. Spending more time looking at the sky, being with the birds, sitting on the ground, breathing; just the basic elements of Earth. Just being here with it. Taking more time to just be here with the Earth, just every day, just loving the Earth. For the very basic, basic everyday existence that it is.
And then the same goes for humans. I love humanity. As a lot of us … we get so busy that we forget that we love people. Because we’re just 40 hours, 50 hours a week to make the money to pay the bills, then we’re tired at the end of the day, and then actually, it’s like, these people are in our way because we’re trying to, you know, get things done efficiently with the little time we have. And so this is my way of taking some time to just love humanity. A very important practice to me. And I’ve been experiencing that very much.
One way of experiencing that is, again, the dependence. I’m dependent upon eating tonight because some of you brought food. And I’m warm because someone brought a blanket. And I might not get rained on tonight because Tanvir brought a tarp. So this practice of dependency helps me to build more of that connection and develop more of that universal love. So this is just ,,, as much as to some people this experiment seems radical or unattainable, it’s actually very practical. I want to be dependent upon others, so here I am doing that.
I’m also testing that to see, can I give more than I receive while having no physical possessions, while having no money? Can I still give more than I receive? That’s part of the experiment. And so, yeah, that’s living in service. That’s been one of the hardest parts so far. I am working to meet my basic needs, which takes time and I’m walking most of where I go. So I haven’t been able to … I really thought I’d spend more time volunteering and I have not been successful with that in this last nine weeks. But where I’ve been focused on being of service is teaching. And sometimes I forget, all of my classes are totally free, accessible, for anybody to come to. Whereas, you know, most of my colleagues charge for these classes. And it’s expected to charge for these classes. And there’s nothing wrong with that. They’re making a living, but I’m just offering all of the knowledge, anything I have inside, freely for anybody to come learn. And that’s the real service that I’ve been able to offer during this time. And then also, I’ve spent a lot of time sharing through videos as well. Being able to share what knowledge I have that’s beneficial to people. So that’s the way that it’s turned out that I’ve been able to be the most of service. You know, we’ve been doing nonviolent communication classes here in the park, and that’s been really meaningful to a lot of people. That’s another way.
And then lastly, before talking about how I’m meeting my basic needs, a big focus of this is … [plane flies overhead] mindfulness. Thank you plane for the reminder to be mindful! Just taking time to be in the present moment has been a huge part of this. And, celebration of life, practicing equanimity, just practicing joy and happiness and compassion. I have a lot more time on my hands to be able to put into those. And I think some people … I doubt that anyone here would think this, but I’m sure some people out there in the world would say, “That sounds like you’re just a bum.” And I would say, “Well, if that’s what you think a bum is, then sure. If you think a bum is a person who dedicates their life to being the most compassionate human being they can who is of service, then I’m like, yeah, we need more bums in the world.” If that’s their belief. We do have this societal belief of, like, constant productivity, and that we should all be working forty plus hours a week to make money and buy stuff, and I just have the belief that I think we need more inner peace. And that’s part of what I’m working on. That inner peace is one of the most valuable things that we can bring to the world.
So now I’d like to share just a little bit about the basics of how this is going. How I’m meeting my basic needs, because that’s a lot of what this is about with simple living, is meeting the basic needs. So I’m gonna talk about a few of those things.
So first, possessions. I am borrowing the items that I … I would go as far as to say need. Well, not need. I don’t need this bowl, but it’s bringing a lot of value to my life. So for the first week-and-a-half, I had just six items that I had borrowed. Now, right now, I have about a dozen or a little bit more. So, I have pants, sweater, oh, now I have a shirt, too. It was just a sweater before. I had just one blanket and now I actually have two blankets at the moment, which I don’t need two. That’s sort of a mishap. I have a sleeping bag, which is very important. The bag that the sleeping bag goes into, which I count as another item because … it’s another item. I have a bowl which I use for drinking. I really like this because I can put it under a sink and fill it with water and rinse, and then I can dump that water onto the plants rather than into the sewer ‘cause I’m doing my best to, you know, love the resources that I work with. A hat, especially for keeping the sun off the nose and the head, towel, a pencil. I usually have one book at a time. Right now it’s “Nonviolent Communication.” I also have a little booklet called “Steps Toward Inner Peace” by Peace Pilgrim. How many of you have heard of Peace Pilgrim? Nice. And I’m working on making a booklet right now, my “Guide to Simple and Sustainable Living,” that one of my teammates is helping with, and so I’m borrowing her book so I can use it as one of my inspirations for having a little booklet that teaches what’s most meaningful to me that I want to share with others. And then some pieces of paper. I think that’s everything. I don’t think I’m missing anything.
So, the clothing. One of the most important things is warmth. It hasn’t been as warm as I’d like so far, I gotta say. I have a preference for it to be warmer. We had a nice warm patch, and I got myself thinking it was gonna stay that way. I got myself craving it would stay that way and I got a little disappointed, saying let’s see how long this warmth is going to last, this warmth is going to last, and then I created suffering for myself because of that. I would have a warm hat but two hats is just too many and I’m trying not to burn my nose, so it’s tricky. My life would be a lot easier if I stepped it up to about eighteen possessions.
On that note, possessions that I would have that I don’t are a Mason jar for drinking water with a lid. It’s a little hard to carry this around sometimes. Socks. Really they would help with the warmth. Shoes. Especially at the time the library kind of nudges me out the door for not having shoes and I have to go to the dumpster and make cardboard shoes and then, you know, put ‘em on. A winter hat and then, during the rain a couple times, a tarp. Those are the main items that I haven’t had. Of course, there’s like a computer and things like that, but I haven’t really wanted those things. These are really the items that I would have. And, like I mentioned, the paper is a tricky area. I would go so far as to say I own these papers, I think. I only own them for a little while, it’s not the highest form of ownership, but I would say I own them. And yeah, it’s been like, for people out there, who aren’t here, it’s been sixties during the day, or fifties, and then lows in the forties and then some days in the seventies, that’s all Fahrenheit. So, you know, you can see it’s a little chilly. Most of us here are … yeah, we’ve got some clothes on.
So, next is food. My basic rule as far as food goes is, I’m not carrying food with me. So it’s just whatever food I get that day is what food I will eat. My original aspiration is that I would only eat what is in front of me in that moment, and I wouldn’t even put it in my hand and carry it a few steps. I’ve definitely bent that some and the reason I’ve bent that some is because of the abundance of the dumpster and how it started was, I went to the dumpster and it was just so full of food I said I gotta take this to my friends. So then, like six days in a row, I came back with bags full of food to bring to the gatherings here. I think I counted, it was probably seven or eight hundred dollars’ worth of food that I rescued from the dumpsters and brought to friends here. And so then that got me into a pattern. I was here for four hours and I would be eating the whole time. So I lost that a little bit. But overall, the only food that I’ve kept overnight is this ginger. So I’ve kept to I only eat basically what’s in front of me, and sometimes things are in front of me for a few hours or so.
And so, the number one way that I’ve been eating is food that is going to waste from dumpster diving or eating from the garbage cans. Down here, there’s a grocery store, about a mile-and-a-half walk away, that is a very abundant dumpster, and some of you have been there with me. And then, that street … I just eat from the garbage like last night we had … what was it … vegetable and steak tacos from a garbage. Only one of the tacos had a bite out of it, otherwise it looked totally good. Plus salmon lox bagel. So, eating pretty well out of the garbages. And then, secondly, gifts. We have people who bring bananas and mango and strawberry that came tonight, and Tanvir brought some ginger shots because of my being under the weather right now. So, I’d be hungry if it wasn’t for the gifts that some people have been sharing. So I’ve been very grateful to share food. Some days it turns into a little potluck. There’s often more food than I would eat, so it becomes a nice little community food eating.
And then, foraging. As you can see around, there’s a lot of green. When I first arrived in Los Angeles, the rainy season hadn’t started yet, so there wasn’t much to forage in early January … or late January. But when I got back from vipassana, I was so happy how greened up it had become, and there’s about twenty plants that I am foraging right now. About a dozen or so different greens, different herbs and then fruits as well. So, a good portion of my nutrition is coming from foraging. My calories are certainly not coming from foraging, but a very substantial portion of my vitamins and my nutrition is coming from foraging highly potent and nutritious greens and herbs. People have been coming out to the foraging walks and learning how they can harvest these as well. People who walked through Griffith Park and didn’t know that any of this was edible, and now they know more. You learned some things, right Garrett? And I will say I’ve been a little hungrier this time than the first ten days that I was here. People knew the experiment real well and most of the people who were coming were people who had followed me, I think, prior to me arriving in L.A. Now, it’s a lot more people who are saying, “Oh, I just heard about you because of a friend last week” or “I just saw you on social media yesterday” and they don’t really know all the depth of what I’m doing. So these days … the first ten days there was always food. Always food. Now, a lot of the times, there’s not, so sometimes I … and then also sometimes the dumpsters have been a little more sparse, so I’ve been more hungry. But, that’s helping me with fasting. I try to intermittent fast almost every day, and sometimes my fasts are a little bit longer. So it’s always a good opportunity to practice fasting. It’s never gone more than eighteen hours, nineteen hours, or something like that. Okay.
So a note on money. I’ve been successful in regard that I have not accepted money. That’s not been an issue. Well, actually, one time I did accept money. I was out under a bridge walking from here to San Diego, and I was talking to a guy who’s homeless, he was sleeping out under a bridge, and he gave me a dollar. I didn’t want to say no … for him it was a meaningful dollar. He earned that dollar and I don’t think he had a lot of dollars, so it was a real gesture for him of a gift. So I just happily accepted it and then I found … I stuck it in a mailbox, like, a couple steps … I just walked and stuck it into a mailbox, so who knows who got the dollar. But other than that, I have not had money. Now other people have obviously spent money, who are sharing food with me and things like that, and I’ve gotten into people’s cars and using gas, but I’ve managed to live a basically moneyless life. Behind the scenes, money is being spent, because I have a team of people who are helping me to spread messages with videos and helping to create events, and they’re paid to do that through a supporter who pays them directly. So my life is not moneyless, and certainly those things make a difference, but as far as the day-to-day operation, it’s now nine weeks of living without money, which is the longest I’ve ever done and I don’t even think about money. It’s a kind of a past thought. It almost never comes across my mind, so it’s been beautiful in that regard.
So, a couple other basic needs. So for water, the first … at the beginning, I did not carry a vessel. I just would have to come to the drinking fountain if I wanted a drink and I was often quite dehydrated. Carrying this bowl makes a significant difference in my life. And, as far as the toilet, I use the public bathrooms, which, I have to say, is like my least favorite thing of anything that I do, which is poop into clean water, flush it down the drain, and then that becomes a burden, it becomes a waste source that has to be dealt with using taxpayer dollars, and there’s the chlorine and the fluoride and all the chemicals and it has to be …. So, it’s a whole big thing. But I will say, I am also using my earth toilet, which is just a hole in the ground, and that toilet is completely up to Earth Code.
What Earth Code is, I meant to mention that at the beginning … Earth Code is living in a way where my actions are in alignment with the Earth. Where it’s not doing harm to Earth, to people, to plants and animals. The flush toilet is not up to Earth Code. It’s completely a system of destruction. My earth toilet, although humanity, well, a lot of people would be, you know … it’s a little timid for me to talk about this because it’s, like, talking about how I’m pooping in a hole in a public park. I’m sure some people would be really angry. However, I am in a spot where it’s a totally … I’m talking about this way more than I was planning to, but here we are. What I’ll say about it is, it does no harm to any human, it’s totally up to Earth Code. It would not cause any issue to people or animals or plants whatsoever, and, in fact, it actually enriches the soil. Now, if every human being was doing this, that would be a problem. But they’re not. I don’t operate based on if every human being is doing it. I operate on the reality of the situation. Also, if every human being did want to do that, it would mean we were thinking very differently about our relationship with Earth, and we’d have compost toilets all over the place to be able to do this. I have officially talked about this far more than I planned, and we’ll see who’s seen this and what happens in that regard. I have three more weeks and I was planning on not talking about this until the day before I was leaving Griffith Park. But here we are.
So, as far as hygiene, going into that. This has been an experiment as far as the personal hygiene. I have no personal hygiene items, except I would say this towel is a very personal hygiene item for my hands and body. But, so no toothbrush. I’m now into nine weeks of not brushing my teeth or flossing or using toothpaste. Instead, I use the California bay tree as my toothbrush, the leaves as a mouthwash and other antimicrobial plants, and my dental floss is these very long pine needles, which works very well and are all over. So the experiment in that regard is going really well. When I first planned this, I thought maybe occasionally someone would bring a toothbrush and I would use it, but I’m fully not. People have brought toothbrushes and I’ve said, “No, I’m really going to go with this.” So my teeth feel as clean as ever and I’m contemplating never using a toothbrush again and instead, just what the Earth provides. There’s a huge cultural relevance here in that, like, in India they use the Neem sticks and in parts of the Middle East they use Miswak, and in parts of the South they use black gum, twigs; and so it’s not a new thing to be able to take care of our teeth without toothbrushes. It’s something we’ve done for thousands of years actually.
And then, I swim in the L.A. river some. On my walk, I swam in the Pacific Ocean. I actually did do a trip up to a little shack where I stayed for a few days up in Ojai where I was bathing in the crystal clear creek there that was joyous. And then sometimes I’ll fill this with water and bring it up to my camp and bathe as well.
So it’s been a real interesting experiment in that regard. I’m used to having essential oils and a handful of … you know, and coconut oil and things like that, and to be just existing in my body with not a single store-bought item, it’s pretty powerful to see that my body is generally thriving and I’m not … I don’t feel lacking of anything. I have no thought whatsoever of if I need this product or that product. It’s completely out of my mind, although sometimes I would like to swish with coconut oil and I did that at vipassana because they had coconut oil there. So.
As far as transportation, it’s mostly walking. I’ve been walking a lot. I’ve walked maybe a couple hundred miles just around Los Angeles, going to the library, getting food, going to the river to swim, going to my meetings, etc. And walking … it’s just been one of those … it’s a practice of joy for me. Walking. I’m slow. I’m moving about as slow as it gets. I stop and I smell the flowers. I’m with the birds. I’m with the trees, with the plants, with the humans, and with my feet … on the earth, getting exercise. I don’t need to go to the gym. I don’t exercise. I just walk. That’s what I do. So it’s been a time of substantial joy to be walking. And also, I sing a lot while I’m walking. My different mindfulness songs. I have been in cars. Numerous times. More times than I would like. But walking has definitely been my main thing.
Okay. A few more things. Light. I don’t have a light, as you can see. So I am living by the light, largely of the sun. However, these lights come on at 7:30, so sometimes I stay down here and read before going up to my bed, and it’s actually been bright enough a couple of times for me to read under the moonlight. But it strained my eyes a little bit, I think. So yes, very much living by the light of the sun to some degree and then the street light. As far as time, I have no watch, so I’m learning more to tell the time by the sun. Since I’m in this place, I can stop and ask people what time it is and look where the sun is and then I know, okay, when I’m standing here and the sun is there, that’s what time it is, and in my particular spot. But I also ask people what time it is a lot.
As far as reading goes, I’m at the library a fair little bit and most … I don’t have a library card, so mostly I read at the library, but also I have friends check out books for me and also I borrow books from a friend. I’m so glad to have this book because I consider this my Bible, and it’s so good to have this back with me to work with on a daily basis.
The hardest part of non-ownership I would say so far for me has been writing. I can accomplish almost everything else without ownership, but as soon as I’m writing on paper, that’s when it’s like, there’s that question of now I own the paper. And for me to be able to write extensively requires more paper and I love writing. So that’s been the hardest part of the absolute non-ownership, is that and I’ve been contemplating … one of the first things that I’ll get when I own something is a notebook, most likely. That may be the first thing that I would have, is a notebook.
Okay. So then a little note on electronic technology usage. That’s been the other hardest part about this. Part of my desire through this … so the experiment of non-ownership didn’t require me to break free from my relationship with the computer or technology necessarily, because I could go to the library and I could use it, or I could borrow someone else’s. I could borrow someone else’s computer and have a computer with me if I wanted to, but part of this has been … this is an opportunity for me to break free from something that … rarely do I meet people in my peer group, in my generation, or the generation above or below me who has a healthy relationship with the cell phone and the computer. And that’s a very important thing for me, is to have a truly healthy relationship. So this three months is a bit of a sabbatical or a hiatus from being on those devices. So I’ve taken a substantial break from that. I gave away my computer. That alone is huge. Just not owning a computer or a phone. And then I’m not even using the one at the library up to this point. That said, I do ask people to look things up and sometimes it feels a little bit, like, disingenuous almost, ‘cause it’s like, well, they’re looking at it for me, so I guess I could just be on there myself. But the thing is, originally I wasn’t going to have people look things up for me and that’s easier said than done. I’m not … it’s hard to remove yourself from all the information on line, especially when we live in a time where the offline information is harder to access. In the past … if I did this twenty years ago, it would have been a lot easier because that support system existed. Now those systems … like, I tried to just get a local map, a detailed map, walking from here to Mexico, stopped at five different libraries. Not a single one had a map of their county, of the roads. I was amazed. So the support system is gone for that. So it’s been really challenging. I made it through fairly flawlessly in the beginning, but on the walk, I started to look at screens sometimes, and just a few days ago, I touched … I actually touched someone’s phone and, like, looked at something on there. So I’m startin’ to be … startin’ to break it a little bit and break down a little bit as far as my strength in that regard. Yeah, I slipped up a few times and I’m just loosening it up a little bit. And the other thing was, originally I wasn’t going to know anything that was going on on social media. But instead lately, Daniel … he’ll be able to tell you that I’m asking him, like, “Yeah, how many views is the video getting?” or you know, “How many followers are there on Instagram?” and so I’ve, uh, as much as I was hoping to break free from … I mean, I’ve made a substantial breaking free from attachment to that stuff. At some times in my life I would check that thing twenty, thirty times in a day and now it’s just like, “Well, I’ll see Daniel in two or three days and I’ll ask him then and we’ll have a quick conversation about it for anywhere between one and ten minutes. So I can handle that. That’s great. I’ve mostly … when it comes to the digital world, I’ve gotten to the place where I’m mostly … I exist … I exist first and foremost here in the present moment, not in the digital world. At times in my life, the digital world has been fifty-fifty, I would say, or even higher in the level of the cravings and attachment to it. But right now, it’s very much the backdrop. I’m using it as a tool of service, and other than that, very little thought about it. So it’s been beautiful in that regard. I’m contemplating going to the library tomorrow … or not tomorrow, the next day, and using the actual internet for the first time. Instead of asking people what the weather will be, just looking up the weather myself. So, we’ll see.
So, that’s the basic needs. And then …. So, oh yes. So one of the big questions was, “Could I be productive in sharing messages while being offline?” And I’m happy to report that “yes” has been the answer. As of now, I’m reaching more people online than I did in the years prior, while I’m completely offline. So that’s great news for me in that I’m trying to come up with a way that for the rest of my life I can mostly be offline but still use it as a tool for good. Still be here present with you all online, who are online, but without myself being so sucked into it and removed from the moment. And so, numerous other videos are getting millions of views, people are watching. I’m meeting many people on the streets who are, like, “Aay! It’s you from the internet!” Whether I’m … several people have actually found me in the act of dumpster diving and having seen me dumpster diving on social media. In the foraging walk yesterday, people came up who had seen me online who came to the foraging walks, out walking about. So it’s been really productive in both widespread but also people just here in Los Angeles as well. So it’s been a beautiful thing and I’m really happy to be … there was the question, like, if I go offline and I don’t own a computer, do I become irrelevant. Do I no longer reach people. And it’s the opposite so far. I’m reaching more people than I had for the years’ prior and I’m so much more productive and efficient with my time. So I’m hopeful that I’ll be able to keep that going for many more years to come. But that would mean you won’t see me responding to comments, hopefully, you’ll just see me here like this.
And then, one other note, is just mentioning as far as working with a team of people, there’s three teammates that I’ve been working with over the last nine weeks or so, and I already mentioned that a little earlier on, but I will say, if I was going to … if I’m living … if I’m doing non-ownership and no money, that’s a big gray area, because they are being paid. It’s not money that I own. It’s a guy who loves what I’m doing and wants my messages to spread, pays them directly. I’m completely decentralized from it. So, it’s very in alignment, but, you know, I like to share that just as far as transparency. And then sometimes I hop into Daniel’s car when we want to … when we have short time and we want to get to the L.A. river to do filming, so it’s like, if I was truly living with no money at all, that would be different because money is being spent, and he’s actually a teammate. So, interesting gray areas in this experiment. But that’s all it is, is an experiment. There are no hard and fast rules. It’s just, yeah, a deep experiment. I have … I will say managing a team of people … it’s been a fair bit of work. I’ve been doing more than I was planning, like planning the events, doing video, there’s a speaking tour that I’m planning for afterwards, and then I’ve gotten into other things like working on creating a booklet, I’ve proofread my former “Food Freedom” book to do a second edition. I have gotten myself into more work than I was planning, which means the team has been working more than planned, which means I spend more time doing that, which means I spend more time struggling to communicate ‘cause it’s one of the hardest things for me to do is manage a team, manage people. And so, it’s been challenging. I’ve had communication struggles and definitely anxiety around that. Yeah, so just a little note on that. It’s been an extensive part of the experiment … my time doing this experiment has been, like, productivity. I’m not on the computer, but they’re often, like, Melissa and Cheryl, they sit here next to me with the computer and they tell me what emails they have that they need my support responding to, or if there’s media, they might set up the computer for me to do an interview. So, a substantial amount of my time goes into that.
So, in closing, I would say, so far, the experiment has been what I was hoping for. What I’ve … I’ve been able to work on what I’ve been wanting to work on. I’ve been able to dissolve a lot. As far as ego goes, I’m still a human being who operates a substantial amount out of ego, but I can say with certainty that it’s dissolved some over the last nine weeks. Of course, the practice of vipassana played a role in that, being there for twenty … three-and-a-half weeks with complete disconnection from the outside world. But also, eating from the garbage helps a lot. Especially in wealthy areas where you have lots of people seeing you in the act. Just eating right out of the garbage, walking barefoot, sleeping in the park, having the rangers know you’re here and not want you here.
Most of what I’m doing is an ego-dissolving thing, not an ego-boosting thing right now and it’s definitely been dissolving. And the identity has been dissolving as well. I still have an identity. But, like, for example, I’m wearing plastic clothes right now. I have a hat with a big old logo on it. I don’t even know what it means. Like, most of this is plastic with logos, and this is, like, I have worked so hard to create the me that had all natural fiber clothing, and so, like, my identity has dissolved substantially. We’ll see how much it comes back, but I can say that it has dissolved a fair bit, which is something that I have been aiming for. Desire has dissolved. There’s not much that I think about. I mean, like, I need to go get some food from the dumpster, I wanna be here at class, you know, connected with the Earth, but there’s not too much … there’s nothing that comes up, like, I need that, or I want that. Really, not much. The desire for, like, … I would say the one would be, like, social media. That’s crept back in some. Views and following and such. But even that’s much smaller.
Separateness has definitely dissolved a lot. And for people who, you know, don’t have experience with that, it would be hard to really describe, but I can just say that I feel inside of myself that I’m much more a part of wherever I am and whoever I’m with and there’s much less of a “you’re you and I’m me and that’s that and this,” you know, I’m that. It’s much more of a … very little thought of separateness and much more of just a feeling of “being a part of.” And I really think owning nothing is very beneficial for that. I really think owning less is beneficial for that. ‘Cause as the identity does dissolve, and you are no longer ‘you,’ you are then what? A little bit more of everything.
Attachment has definitely dissolved some. And then, yeah, the ownership. You know? I really like a wool sweater, but I don’t need to own it. But that’s what I would really like. A homemade knitted wool sweater. I still have some element of, like, but overall the concept of ownership has largely dissolved. So it’s definitely been beneficial in that way.
And, uh, yeah, as far as being in the practice of being in the present moment. It’s been a very productive practice of being much more in the present moment. Just not having a cell phone or a computer does so much in that regard. And a lot of joy and happiness and a lot of equanimity.
So the last thing that I’ll share about is … well, actually, two little things. What was it again? Oh. The truth aspect. So when I … when I … around the time I arrived in Los Angeles, I made a four-year commitment to existing in complete truth. Telling only the truth and not telling a lie. I haven’t managed to do that perfectly. A couple reasons why: (1) At times, I’ve been kind of hiding from the park rangers, so that’s not fully truthful, ‘cause if I was fully truthful, I would just sleep where I’m sleeping and there’d be no hiding whatsoever. Although, now I’ve come to a place where I’m no longer hiding. That’s taken care of. But when I was at vipassana, I was barefoot and you’re not allowed to be barefoot, and there’s certain things like that, that were kind of untruthful. I wasn’t able to be in full integrity and I was kind of, like, hiding little things. Like I unscrewed the outdoor light bulb because I wanted it to be dark, and then they later said, “Oh, the light bulb was out.” And I said, “Oh, I don’t know anything about that.” I did go back to them a few hours later and said, “Actually I unscrewed it. I lied.” And then, so there’s … oh, and then also … someone invited me over to their place and they gave me their door code. So I have a code in my head. So that’s a secret that I have. I had no secrets. I have that in my head. I have two codes, I think, in my head. And so, I … that … so the practice of complete, 100% honesty and transparency is not, you know, fully there, but that practice has continued, you know, deeply, and I’m grateful to be a part of that aspect of the experiment.
So, I want to acknowledge my privilege a little bit. Some people when they hear, you know, acknowledging a privilege, they think that you would do that because of virtue signaling, or guilt or shame. I do that because of how so incredibly relevant it is and because I believe not understanding that and acknowledging it, for me would be existing in a state of delusion. For me to say that my life is, you know, that this is going to be different for me than if it were a black man doing this, or if it was a … you know, if it was a person homeless not by choice, or a person who doesn’t have a US, you know, legal documentation. Or a woman, you know, sleeping outside. “Hello! Glad you’re here!” So there’s so, you know, so many aspects where I have my need for safety and stability met and, you know, I have a huge social circle of people who support me that makes this so much easier. So I think … I just want to share that because it’s so important and it’s important to a lot of people out there, and it’s important to me. So, I think that’s … I’m so glad to … oh, yeah, on that note, the last part of that is, there’s kind of the question of, like, “Am I homeless?” And what I want to say about that is it depends on who you ask. Some people say, like, “Yeah, that guy’s obviously homeless.” Like, “He wears a blanket, he sleeps outside, he eats from the garbage. He doesn’t have a home. He’s homeless.” And there’s nothing you could say otherwise to convince them that I’m not homeless. They’d be like, “No, that guy’s homeless.” Then you could talk to some other people and they’d be, like, “No way. He’s not homeless. He’s there by choice.” Like, “If he wanted to, he could have a home. He’s not homeless.” And you couldn’t convince either of them one way or the other. So, am I homeless? The answer is, of course, is that homelessness is a concept. It’s a concept that depends on which culture you’re in and where you are in the world. So, I would say, “No, I’m not homeless. But I am also homeless, too. At the same time.” There’s no clear answer to it, but I am here from a place of privilege. That is … that’s a very real thing. So yeah, on that note, I’m so grateful to have been able to share all of this. See, I took a lot of notes. I wanted to kind of share this in depth. [Points to helicopter overhead] I no longer have any concern that they’re looking for me. Although today, I was laying naked in my spot and they did circle over twice, kind of tilted in my direction. I was like, “I better put my pants on now, just in case.” No, it has nothing to do with us. So, yes, I’m very grateful to have been able to share, and I hope that that was not too much, like, information or, you know, too long.
On that note, does anybody have any questions? Is there anything alive in anyone that they’d like to ask about?
“I like the exploration of non-ownership, living simply, connecting with nature, dissolving the self, living in the present, and there are some people who do that in communities. You participated in some of them. At vipassana retreat. I mean monastic communities around the world do that in different ways. Vipassana retreat is one kind of that. People don’t generally live there, but people do support the vipassana community and people live there for months, and I think maybe years at a time, and there’s other monastic traditions, like how I know you and Thich Nhat Hanh and there’s a monastery here where people live with no possessions, dissolving the ego, living in the present. So how do you relate to those communities? How is what you’re doing … why are you doing something different than going … a lot of the goals could be accomplished there.”
Yeah. Yeah! So the question is about doing this in community versus alone. And the reality is that non-ownership is much … is most applicable through community, not through individualism. Now, in a sense, I’m very much doing this as community, because I have built more of a … I have built a different community in the sense that wherever I go there’s people that support me and I truly feel like we are in community together, so I definitely don’t feel like I am doing this alone. It’s a bit more of an in-between type of thing. Now, the easiest thing … way to do this would be to live in community. There are some communities where you actually get … you no longer own everything and everything is communal. I think Acorn over on the East coast is one example of that, the Acorn community, and Thousand Oaks is another model of that and, of course, many Buddhist monks, you know, are part of monasteries where there’s no ownership. And I would very much also like to practice that. And me being at the … me being at vipassana was a bit of the practice of that, although that’s less of a community because people are generally in and out. But, all to say, in the long term, my intention is to spend long periods of time in community … in communities, maybe being actually a part of an intentional community or an ecovillage, or even potentially living at a monastery for a period of time possibly. Actually, when I was contemplating this experiment as I was walking from Canada to here, I did think about reaching out to the L.A. Zen Center about maybe living there during this time in community. So, I think community is the true solution to so much of our problems in the world. I would really say that there’s no solution that I want to be a part of that does not involve community at its core. And probably with more and more time, you’ll see me more immersed in that. In fact, after this tour, I’m potentially gonna do a few week community tour. Or after this project, I might do a few-week intentional community tour. So that very much wraps into that. Yeah.
“I appreciate it and I ask, in part, because I think our culture is so individualistic that those communities have difficulty speaking to mainstream society. It’s not a live-in option for most people to join a monastery or join Acorn. I don’t know much about it, but based on what you’re saying. And I think doing it the way that you’ve done it does give you [unintelligible]. “
Yeah, so if you are interested in learning more about community, there’s FIC.org, that’s the Foundation for Intentional Communities, and then there’s the Global Ecovillage Network, which is Ecovillage.org, I believe. And I have a page on my website, robingreenfield.org/community that shares. But, intentional community is accessible. Here in Los Angeles, there’s the Los Angeles Ecovillage and they host events sometimes where you can come to, you know, experience the life there some. And so, I intend to be teaching and sharing about living in community in the months and years ahead. Any other questions? Yeah? Holly?
“Mine is a bit of a side note. I’m just curious what your dreaming is like.”
Oh, my dreaming.
“Day dream? Night dream?”
Ohmigosh.
“Mainly I’m thinking of your night dreams when you’re out here in the ….”
I don’t want to give the honest answer here, but I’m going to. I dream about sex a lot. You know, I’m doing my six years of non-sexuality. I’m two years and a few months in and I’m not even … I really don’t even want to have sex right now. I’m so content not having sex, but for some reason, lots of dreams, lots of sex dreams and usually they’re not even fairly enjoyable. It’s usually like … it’s like, kind of start and then, like, a giraffe pops up or something like that. It’s like … it’s never like … it’s usually, like, interrupted and half. So lots of that. I do have a fair number of anxious dreams still. It’s a very relevant question you ask because although I’ve made such great progress in my waking time, my sleeping time is where I have the most progress that needs to be made. I actually have said out loud many times, if there’s one thing I could do that would … one of the things I will say that would improve my life the most would be to stop having all of these dreams, because a lot of them are so vivid and potent that I wake up and I’m, like, “Was that a dream? Or was that real life?” So, and lately I’ve been having … I’ve had vivid dreams for decades, but lately I’ve had as much as usual or more potentially. So yeah, a lot of sex and a lot of anxiety, interestingly enough. So, I know there’s work to be done because I do believe that my dreams are just a representation of my day, more or less. I also think they’re mostly a random firing of … I think they’re mostly a random firing of synapses, so I don’t give it a lot of, like, … I don’t give it a whole lot of weight. But yeah, I wish that they were more, like, dreams of me just being of service. That would be nice if I just, at night, if I just dreamed all night of being of service to people. For the next week, every night, I’m going to have thoughts of service before bed and see if I can trigger that to be my dreams. Any one or two last questions? I know it’s getting to be close to sunset here.
Yeah?
“Just to understand it more. Because you mentioned a little the idea of, you know, I think like finding a healthy sort of balance of, like, using versus owning, and then, ‘cause you’re not … down to zero ownership and then also, like, [unintelligible] technology as well. We’re not at zero with technology. I was just wondering, how do you see them, like, how do you see them [unintelligible] after [unintelligible] is done, what do you want to return to? In relation to ownership.”
Yeah. I’m glad that you also brought that up. Because I would love, in closing, to share, the intention is not for anybody to do what I’m doing. That’s not the point at all. This is an extreme experiment. If anybody wants to do this experiment, great. I highly recommend it. If anybody wants to go to the extreme, wonderful, I’m here and I support you. However, I take things to the extreme to create critical thought, to create deep self-reflection, to create conversations in society. And also because I want to be doing it, because I want to go really deep. But the message is to ask. Ask questions about our own lives. Are we happy with the way we’re living? Are we living the lives we want? Are our lives causing destruction? Are we okay with that? Are our lives creating, you know, quality and harmony in the world or is it instead, playing, you know, into the inequity gap and such. Asking those questions and saying, “What do we really want?” And then saying, if we’re not living what we want, how do we move in that direction? And so, for people that realize that, my website is a very helpful resource. I have my list of the first 100 changes that I made. It goes step-by-step with 100s of different changes that anybody can make if they want to break free from these systems and live a life of more harmony. So again, it’s not about anybody doing just as I do. It’s about living lives of integrity and truth and harmony and asking the questions about what works for ourselves. No doubt though, if we are talking about true integrity and harmony, it takes radical change, not just little changes. Little changes aren’t enough to speaking of true, you know, harmony and integrity. And to give a bit more concise answer to your question as far as what I … my intentions are … I mean my dream is to … the only possessions that I own are items that are made of materials harvested sustainably from the earth by myself or someone that I know, either I created or they created, and that whatever I have, if I lose it, or if I fall to the earth wearing it, it could return to the earth. Which would mean not having a computer or solar panel or anything. That’s the dream. Can I accomplish that? I think ‘yes.’ Will I accomplish that? Maybe. We’ll see. That the … the experiment very much continues in that regard. For me, though, will I end up owning a computer again? Perhaps. But I think maybe … there’s a good chance that I could free myself from ownership of all those devices and instead just say, “You know what? I just need to be on the computer three times a week for two hours, and I can do that at a communal computer. And we can share those resources.” I’m a huge advocate for sharing resources. It’s not about … ownership is not about not having access to what we need. We can still have access to what we need through sharing. Tool libraries, for example. We don’t all need to own tools. We can have resources for that. Community composting. We don’t all need to have a compost bin. We can have central locations for composting. The libraries. One of the most wonderful examples of sharing. Car share programs. Bike share programs. Clothing swaps. Living in community. There’s so many, so many examples of how we don’t need to own things to have access to them. So the sharing economy, the gift economy: these are things to look into. So. As far as my long term? My long term is I would like to build a little home that’s made completely from the resources from the earth, has a little, you know, woodstove in it, you know, that I’m just burning wood from the earth. And that everything that I have when I die can just return to the earth and ceases to exist within some decades. And whether I get there is completely unlikely, but somewhere in that realm or so. And continuing to work with others. Continuing to work with Daniel and people like Daniel who have cameras and come out and share it and still be able to use technology but not need to be owning them myself is definitely part of the plan for now. So. Alright, Dear Friends who are watching out there through the internet, we love you very much and we are grateful for you and see you again soon.
Articles referred to:
The Experiment in Non-Ownership – Robin Greenfield in Los Angeles
The Experiment in Non-Ownership – My “Why” and In-Depth Explanation
Non-Ownership in the Physical, Digital and Mental Realms
The Timeline of My Journey to Complete Non-Ownership
The above is a transcription of The Experiment of Non-Ownership – Week 9 Update, which is part of Robin’s “Truth Talks” series during his experiment in non-ownership.
For the full series and depth to this practice visit: The Experiment in Non-Ownership – Robin Greenfield in Los Angeles.